並前往https://www.audacy.com/podcast/straight-up-talk-%E7%9B%B4%E5%99%8F%E5%A0%82-d2295/episodes/ep21-%E6%9C%AA%E6%81%A4%E9%AB%AE%E5%85%88%E8%88%88%E5%A5%AE-9f8cf
