並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep-60-%E5%88%A5%E6%80%95%E6%88%91%E5%9C%A8%E9%80%99-%E5%8E%9F%E4%BE%86%E6%97%A5%E6%9C%AC%E4%B9%9F%E6%9C%89%E5%BD%BC%E5%BE%97%E6%BD%98-%E6%97%A5%E6%9C%AC%E5%A6%96%E6%80%AA-%E5%BA%A7%E6%95%B7%E7%AB%A5%E5%AD%90/id1526048089?i=1000510553864